Executive Social Strategy

Full Transcript

Confessions of a Higher Ed EMO S2E3

Jaime Hunt: [00:00:00] Hi, I'm a higher ed CMO and I have a confession to make well, I think that having a digital community and being really active on social media is a critical part of doing our jobs in marketing and communications. I haven't always had a direct strategy for how to do that. And when I did start to read the book written by the guests that we're gonna have today and saw her talking about intentionality and authenticity, it made me shift how I approach social.

From a personal branding perspective. And I have seen my follower count explode, uh, since doing that. And so I wanted to bring Josie on to have this conversation with everybody. So you can kind of hear a little bit more about how to be a digital leader in the fire education.[00:01:00] 

Welcome to confessions of a higher ed CMO, the podcast designed for higher education marketers. I'm your host, Jamie hunt. And I am so excited to have this opportunity to share insights and inspiration with confessions of a higher ed CMO. I'm designing a different kind of podcasting experie. With each episode, I'll be bringing in a guest for a deep dive, into the challenges and joys.

We all face in higher education marketing. After each episode, you can join the conversation on Twitter by using the hashtag higher ed CMO. I would love to see this become like a book club, but for a podcast and be sure to follow me on Twitter at, at Jamie hunt IMC. That's J a I M E H U N T I M C for more opportunities to.

I'm so happy to be here today with Josie Quis, author of digital [00:02:00] leadership and higher education and a very popular and in demand speaker and consultant. Hey Josie, how are you? 

Josie Ahlquist: Hi, Jamie. Thanks so much for the invitation. 

Jaime Hunt: I'm so excited to have you come on and talk with us about digital leadership. But before we jump into that, tell me a little bit about yourself and your journey that got you to this point.

Josie Ahlquist: Oh my gosh. So I was actually scrolling back a little bit and it was 10 years ago. This fall was my last. Fall move in with like student leaders. I was on a campus. Wow. Um, and I really kind of, this is honestly the time of year I miss it the most BEC I mean, it's just palpable the energy. And especially this year, you can like, we're actually able to like safely move in and do events and classes.

So it was the next year that I actually was already in a doc program and just started to have my mind opening up to like different ways that I could serve higher ed. Um, [00:03:00] and so I had a great advisor at the time say, well, we have the, we, you know, we've got assistantships. Like you don't have to just work and you could start to do some research.

And honestly, that just kind of took off. Full nerd alert. so I was getting my doctorate and what my research was all about was how students were using social media. And then I also had this other passion of looking at how campus leaders were intentionally showing up. And this was like 2012. Um, and so, I mean, they weren't early adopters, but I just started to really see some differences both in front of, and behind the screen.

And so that led to like me being asked to speak and starting to coach and consult behind the scenes, um, in many, uh, good trouble that I got into, um, throughout the years. . 

Jaime Hunt: So when you talk about digital leadership, what do you mean by that? 

Josie Ahlquist: [00:04:00] so it's an intentional approach to embrace yourself. No matter your position title that you could make an impact online.

Especially early days of my research, I would run into positional executive leaders that say, would say what wouldn't believe leadership or influence, or I making an impact where would be possible on a platform like Twitter. And I was like, well, you're already kind. Set up for, not a lot to happen with that perspective because I come from a leadership lens too.

Like my bookcase behind me is full of leadership books, but none of 'em. Are you gonna find how you would take, for example, servant leadership or authentic leadership? What does that look like on Instagram and, or is it even possible? So I just started to what I called remix leadership theories. and tried to apply them to the digital space and where they fit, where they don't.

Because also a lot of leadership [00:05:00] theories were written by old white men. research researching mostly white college men, um, that aren't applicable today. So many of them are already need to, to be critically analyzed. And so then I started to look for trends, both asking leaders like, well, what theories are you already drawn to?

And then just seeing how they were making. Choices, um, ex like the leaders I found early on, what I just absolutely loved was students were reacting positively, like, oh my gosh, what a thing we need to celebrate is that, uh, you know, a vice president. Who sharing, like one post about how they took their dog to the vet and then like three students the next day, coming up to them, asking them how Charlie is.

And she never had met them before, but the dog was the welcome mat. It was the handshake that sometimes we just don't have. Especially during COVID [00:06:00] in, in face to face, or even sometimes an email interaction that I said there is something here. Like we need to stop minimizing these platforms. I know they are problematic a lot, but if we actually are empowering both campus leaders, as well as college students, how can you approach these tools differently?

Maybe we actually have a fighting chance to make them a little better. That that is 

Jaime Hunt: awesome. I, I worked at Winston-Salem state for a while for Elwood Robinson. Who's the chancellor there. And he had a really active social media presence. And I think it walking across campus with him was like every student knew who he was.

Everybody wanted to have a selfie with him. They wanted to be featured on his social media. And that actually was really eye opening for me in terms of thinking about how. I am present on social media and actually caused me to create a separate social media account for my professional self, [00:07:00] um, and kind of mimic that.

But there's a lot that goes into doing all of that. And why, why do you think that. Work is important. Why should we be thinking about having a social media presence as executives? 

Josie Ahlquist: I mean, for a chief marketing officer to also say like you needed to take a step back and create your own strategy was the biggest gap in my research that I found even the most public residents do not have a strategy or support behind them and in any other area of their job, that just wouldn't.

I'm not saying it wouldn't be allowed, but wouldn't be ideal. And I don't wanna, I'm not recommending that we go so extreme is that we have, you know, ghost writers and like the account. Doesn't like, I actually, some of my favorite accounts from campus leaders to follow it is them , it's definitely them posting, but I do think part of leadership is self-awareness.

You have to. Have [00:08:00] some, you know, like deep thoughts about what's your values. What's important to me. Uh, how do I wanna show up in this world? Whether if that's in email in a classroom or on TikTok and then start to make those choices. So that's why I realize, okay, I can go out and do speaking and workshops, but some of these leaders actually need a little.

it's almost like therapy. Like we're working through their fears, their frustrations, their perceptions about platforms, or, you know, there's a generational thing too. Like, you don't wanna look. not professional or less than, but like your example, you can do some really simple things that can go such a long way.

And again, what I am kind of trying to combat often is especially the perception is, oh, you're looking unprofessional or why are you, you know, like pandering, but no, you're just being a person. yeah. We need students to feel like [00:09:00] they belong. And I think some of our campus leaders can be key ingredients in belonging, not the only thing.

Um, but why not try to elevate that a little bit more 

Jaime Hunt: into the pot? . Yeah, I, I, I think that's so such wisdom there. Um, and it's, it's to your point, it's another channel to be able to speak to students and speak to alumni or whatever the ad your primary audience is. Right. What do you think leaders need to be thinking about if they already, maybe they already have, um, some presence on digital channels, but they wanna kind of amp up and take it to the next level.

What, what advice would you have? 

Josie Ahlquist: Well, I think it's to again, look at these platforms, just like any other strategy or way of being is just imagine if you could just [00:10:00] have another layer of support. So I take photography a lot as an example, because exa especially now that we're in person, often, there are some times where grabbing a selfie or asking someone nearby to take a photo is actually probably gonna be way cooler.

I, uh, I guarantee there's probably like three experiences this week that are, it's gonna be best for you to be like in the crowd you're present, you're doing your thing. Strategize beforehand, who's gonna be the one taking the photos and then capturing it. Or my example a lot is, um, I got my doctor in education on English.

So there's gonna be typos in what I write. So who else can help copy, edit your tweets or some other, you know, like Instagram posts that could just kickstart you in order? Cuz the biggest thing I'm trying to work with with leaders is consistency and it's. Pretty easy this time. Well, we're recording in August, so there's so much going on.

You could just, you could probably [00:11:00] post too much right now. Um, but we know there's quieter times when you could potentially have some big gaps. So look who else in your core team. So this could be a grad student, a student, your executive assistant, um, your CMO to think bigger strategies that. Start to be integrated with some more strategic campaigns, even for the whole university.

Jaime Hunt: Hey, all. I hope you're enjoying this episode of confessions of a higher ed CMO. I wanna take just a quick moment to thank my friends at Nector who made this new enrolled podcast possible. Nectar brings affordable communications infrastructure to college campuses. It's like slack, but for the higher ed student experience.

Hector integrates seamlessly with all major LMSs, making it easy for instructors and administrators to build emergent learning communities in all of their classes and groups without the extra work, their focus is on boosting student engagement and reducing instructor stress by building a learning [00:12:00] community in every classroom by leveraging familiar technologies like instant messaging channels, Nector prepares students for the remote yet collaborative work environment of the future.

You can learn more about their platform by heading on over to. That's N E C T I R dot I O. And be sure to tell the team that Jamie sent you their way. I think I like that idea of it being integr, an integrative campaign with the whole university. Like that is I think, critically important so that you're, you're having that sort of unified.

I don't know if presence is the right word, but that, or even message, but just that there's consistency 

Josie Ahlquist: there. I mean, you, you probably have a different audience or a different lens than the main institutional accounts. I've seen some vice presidents or even provost that, you know, they have a higher influence online than the main account or even the president.

So why not leverage their [00:13:00] voice to help, you know, get out whatever that main, um, marketing plan. . 

Jaime Hunt: So when you're in your book, you talk about using a values based approach to leadership in digital spaces. Tell me a little bit more about that and why that's important. 

Josie Ahlquist: So again, the challenge that I'm up against many times when I'm trying to present.

Social media strategy and especially leadership online a little differently is sometimes these platforms can feel like busy work that we're just trying to keep up that, um, we're questioning if we really should be on tools, you know, those are just for the kids. Um, and so I always wanna get back to the bigger, why, like, what's your, why, what is your, why?

For your life for your position. Like what's really calling at you cuz that's your values. So if I was to look at your Facebook, your Instagram, do I see your values even in the, on the screen? Um, what those and that could literally be your [00:14:00] strategy is these five values you always wanna have show up, you know, every week, every month.

Like, and I wouldn't, you know, maybe it's family or reading, like it doesn't have to be really complicated cuz then that's gonna start to. Get you in the fields instead of just feeling like, okay, I, I need to force this because I do use language like authenticity in the book, which is obviously as us and our identities are always evolving and changing, but we.

What we don't want. And I'm starting to see unfortunately, more and more of is a lot of robotic accounts for campus leaders because they have been a little bit swallowed up within marketing offices that it starts to just feel like a department page rather than a person. Like to even debate, oh, what should their username?

Or can we own this account after they leave? Like, these are the wrong questions to be asking. like, [00:15:00] this is a person. Well, you can never guarantee your president's gonna stay. Right, right. Let alone yourself. So it's an ingredient that. The other goal within value space, it's personalized. It should feel true to them.

It doesn't mean you're posting photos of your food, unless let's say you're an amazing cook or like me, maybe you had a really big fail in television. And so that's gonna be an interesting story to 

Jaime Hunt: tell to. when, when you're talking about those like robotic accounts, I'm thinking about the sort of the stereotypical, um, thank you to X student org for inviting me to do X or Y.

It was so great seeing this amazing group of students and having just like a string of that and replace the X and Y with. Stuff and right. That I think that can maybe seem like it's a formula, right. It's easy for people to do it that way. How do you get them to [00:16:00] reframe how they think about what they're posting so that it has a little bit more intentionality to it?

Josie Ahlquist: I think the personalization, it comes out a little bit. Like how do you normally talk? And also to know the language of the internet is different than an email. So, um, you know, can, can emojis be involved? Can, uh, or which emojis not to use to be involved. This is also why I'm a fan of visuals from a video or a photo that honestly says.

For you, um, and might be wise, for example, why you might wanna coach to help cultivate some of that language or to point out to you, like, Hey, all your posts this last week started with the word or ended with the, you know, so yeah, we wanna add some variety. I also have an empathetic understanding of. You are going back to back.

And so again, like what is your other support, knowing that your [00:17:00] account really does have a great amount of influence. And so someone else could maybe take that to a more personalized 

Jaime Hunt: level. There are some leaders that I follow that I love to see sort of how they blend their personal life in with their professional life.

Um, is that a good idea? Is that something that we should be trying to avoid? 

Josie Ahlquist: so it is the reason why I use the language personalization. Here's the reality is the internet doesn't care. Whether you have a lockdown, Instagram account, or you texted someone through a lockdown platform, like the internet is going to take it and run with it.

Right. So it's also why I teach a values base. It's like, you need to live your life no matter if it's public or private. Now I do think again, through the leadership lens of self-awareness you think through. What are the elements of my life that I do want to share. And this is within, [00:18:00] um, even a, um, privilege, identity, social justice lens that some.

Individuals in higher ed sometimes based on position, can't share themselves like, like they are, there is a huge risk for them to share certain elements of their lives. So we do have to acknowledge privilege and power, which also when you kind of really dig into leadership by definition, there's, there's a lot.

Dialogue to be had there. Um, so I would start with the lowest hanging fruit possible. So don't feel like, oh my gosh, am I gonna share. You know, like about my faith or my kids. What's your favorite movie right now? like, what book did you just read? Jamie? I learned so many good books from you. um, like, oh, I'm gonna grab that one.

Okay. She said that one's not so great. Um, puppies kit, like, yes, you should go and rescue a dog because I am pro dog adoption [00:19:00] um, or just get yourself around a dog, like, so I don't want you to feel like you have to overcomplicate how you. Add some personalization to your feed. Um, rather than again, feeling like it has to be more substantial of a, of a reveal about yourself, um, because you do have to make some of your own choices, but like I shared at the very beginning, that example of a vice president, you know, having to go to the emergency vet and sharing about it, the ROI was now she.

Three new students who had never came up to her before, because she just happened to share that post cuz they connected and worried about her doc. 

Jaime Hunt: I think like the, you make a really good point. Like you don't have to have a, a cons. Uh, what's the word I'm looking for? I'm sorry, Rob. Um, you don't have to have a controversial view.

um, be how you're personalizing. Um, one of the folks I follow it's her pictures of her grandbaby and [00:20:00] how excited she is to see her grow. And, you know, it's just kind of fun to see that kind of thing. Um, so kind of, you've talked a little bit about purpose driven, digital leadership, and that is in your tagline, in your, your website.

Tell me a little bit about what you mean. 

Josie Ahlquist: I think it really pulls all the elements together that we've been talking about. Um, really from the research and the, you know, framework that I teach is five guiding principles. Personalization is one of them. Um, legacy is another that's basically that leadership ingredient, like what's the impact that you wanna make.

We talked about strategy. from what I have found many leaders don't have it. And that's why we need to make a stand to say, you need to have one. I don't need a built out calendar or that you've like created posts for the next two months, but I do need you to have at least a [00:21:00] couple goals. And some tactics that you can track to know it's actually making a difference.

And then we can like take you to the next level. with some, with some, uh, analytics from there. Um, the, the other element is change. Um, In the five guiding principles and we've had to go through a heck of amount of change. and I know there's lots of research out there that some leaders just couldn't kick it and had a really, really hard time.

These platforms. Technology, social media, whatever it is, is gonna change without our say, and to be able to not just kind of go with it, but to surround yourself with people like you like me, like people on your campus that can help be your educators. Cuz I also don't need a president or a provost to be an expert on TikTok.

That's not the best use of their time unless. Super passionate about it and are like, no, this is my jam. My kids at home have taught me. I'm [00:22:00] ready to go. That's amazing. And then the last ingredient of purpose driven digital leadership is really been the through line of my work since the beginning is I have always seen the possibilities for these platforms for connection and community, not just getting information across and promotion.

And so I, I coach. Executives to have the intent to actually make a connection with another human, hopefully not a robot on the other side of the screen. And then in higher ed, we wanna see that as hopefully an in person connection and an email, like what's the ROI then that we could start to track to know that this is making a 

Jaime Hunt: difference.

So you've talked a little bit about measurement and tracking and ROI. What kinds of things are you looking for when you're measuring that? 

Josie Ahlquist: Well, I think it's actually a growing area for campus leaders. So of course you can track real basics. Like, are your accounts [00:23:00] growing? Are people actually responding?

Just the same thing that we would look for in our, you know, like primary accounts, but we add layers onto that, which is, you know, like, what are what's their next steps? Are they planning to stay in this presidency? Are they retired? Like how can we connect it back into. You know, bigger life goals and then institutional goals too.

So we talked about campaigns a little bit ago. Like how can we integrate and set your account up to also be part of these bigger strategies that the university is having? Maybe we know that. This next fall, you are making an intentional effort to connect with specific subset of alumni. That could be a goal that we have for your account.

That's why we are gonna double down on LinkedIn because we know that's a particular tool that we could maybe measure and put strategy together. That's gonna help find, um, alumni that have, um, left the. 

Jaime Hunt: [00:24:00] One of the things that I have consistently heard from, uh, senior leaders and executives throughout my time in higher ed is fear that putting themselves out on social media will open them up to criticism.

And I do know, um, one leader and I'm not gonna say where it is just to kind of protect this person, but they were receiving, um, threats against their children, um, because of. That happened at the institution. And do you have any advice for, for leaders if they get into that type of situation or they have that type of concern?

oh my gosh, 

Josie Ahlquist: it's hard. I, I had just one slice of an experience where I was getting some harassment and my account was getting like duplicated a million times on Twitter. And it almost feels like someone is banging on your door or like has gotten into your house. Like it, it feels like they are there. So I wanna acknowledge a for women and prioritize identities.

We. Twice as much. And those are actually the [00:25:00] leaders that I want to see even more out there. So that's where I also acknowledge like the risks that this does take and to ensure that you've done everything in your due diligence to not only protect your accounts from ensuring you have your two factor authentic, like some of these tools that we would already make sure that we would do for.

Institutional accounts that they're protected. Um, but also I've had some leaders that have someone else vet for example, DMS, or they would see a comment first, because for example, let's say you are in a time of crisis on your campus, or, you know, a big announce that's coming out. That's gonna get some pushback, maybe the best use of time for that leader.

Isn't going to be getting this barrage of DMS or comment. But it is to do that town hall and to be able to fully show up in that zoom meeting and in, in person. So someone else is gonna keep an eye on those. So that's why I also think it's important work with your vice P or chief [00:26:00] marketing officer. Like.

Your executive is like, who else can be support when things are not going great. Um, and to notify the university to be a piece of the puzzle to ensure like, okay, I'm part of the brand and identity here, and I'm starting to receive, you know, some of this stuff from the outside. This is also where I.

Encouraging everyone listening, not just if you were an executive, like we and I, this is my own life journey too. Jamie is we need to learn to log off like leaders approach any tool with intention. And it is so darn easy to just, not only to check email, but to get pulled back into these platforms. So then.

If anything in extreme, isn't going to result in our best. And so I'm trying to give leaders permission to set some of those guardrails so they can just, even in their own, you [00:27:00] know, being recover that technology, you know, in excess can diminish that. So I'm integrating all kinds of more wellness work.

Whether if it's a workshop, we're gonna do some deep breaths and. Breathing or, um, you know, some, we, we need some more tools to take ourselves out of these tools. Um, that can be a. . 

Jaime Hunt: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, when I hear about people making threats against other people's families, it's like, that's the dark side of, um, digital community, but there's so many benefits and I hate for that to scare people off.

Um, because I, I just, I love the community that I have and the connections that I've made through social media. And I think it can be really, really transformative for your career as well. Um, to. You know, a, a visible member of whatever community you're in. 

Josie Ahlquist: Um, and I think the ideal, and I've seen this in more of the influencer space, [00:28:00] or, I mean, even, you know, like very large public personas is if you really do build an online community, they will come for you.

They will, um, in the comments, like correct or call out those that are, you know, spreading misinform or what, whatever it is. Um, but also know that well, a platforms have some reporting things in, in place. Mm-hmm , if you need to lock things down, like making those choices and also like in anything else, like.

file a official report. Like don't feel like just cuz it's happening in a private digital space that you know, it's not real or that it's not serious. Mm-hmm and so take measures as you absolutely 

Jaime Hunt: need. that's one thing. Um, when I manage social media more directly, that I was never afraid to take something to campus police.

If I perceived that there was a [00:29:00] threat cause at worst case, like absolute worst case scenario, somebody does something horrible. And if you didn't, if you knew or had an inkling that it's something that could happen. I feel like you have a responsibility to let police sort out, whether that's, um, a legitimate threat or not.

Um, and that you. you should pass that along, right? You don't wanna be the person that's like, oh, well this person saw it and they didn't do anything. Mm-hmm but to pivot, I'm a little bit more pleasant thread of conversation. Um, are there any people that you think are really good role models in this space and what are they doing that sets them apart in your mind?

Josie Ahlquist: Oh my gosh. So I have a whole list and I'll send you user names and things. So that's the other element of the book. Packed with examples. Um, and I tried to get on a lot more photos than, um, was approved by my publisher. cause I think honestly, following all like people that. [00:30:00] And, and you almost like try them on, so you look at a president or a vice president and how they use Instagram.

And you're like, okay, I like this part of their bio. That's interesting. They're posting this kind of theme. I'm not sure if that would fit with me. That's the nice thing about social is you're trying to do this self awareness and then the other element of like, okay, what's congruence for me, what feels aligned?

You can be inspired by what others are doing. So even on Twitter, I have a few different lists that you could. Quickly find like all campus presidents that I've been able to find on Twitter or vice presidents or women execs. Um, so, so honestly mine, um, are full of personality. Like what I, and. when you think about capturing moments that can just jump off the screen.

And I'm not saying they need to be like wild and kooky, but like you can just see emotion and this is why skills like photography and videography. Aren't just something [00:31:00] that you can like pick, like it, it's a trained skill that yes. Maybe you need to teach that to your president or that you, you have someone on your team that can do it.

Um, so. Keith Carver he's at UT Martin. He's on lots of platforms in Kelly damp house at Texas state. Um, they've got people just capturing all kinds of moments, whether they're in a golf cart or they're doing a dance on the quad, um, or just having a really solemn moment in their office. And I think the other element is storytelling.

Like you said, you're not just posting and be like, thank you for inviting me. Like you're explaining. Meaningful thing happened and that might be surprising to people listening. Like, no, you don't have to just write a sentence. It could be a longer, um, mm-hmm copy even on Twitter, if you turn it into a thread.

Um, I also love community college presidents. Mm-hmm because you can just tell, I mean, a, I think so many leaders are here for just such good reasons, but there's just something I think maybe cuz [00:32:00] I grew up in Wyoming and um, you know, I, you could just see their blood, sweat, and tears for these students. And so Mordecai, Brownley, he's at the community college of Aurora.

He also does a lot of interesting things with video, um, Dar Willis. She also is doing this Instagram interview in her office series. Um, that's kind of like a podcast, but all on Instagram and then Claudia Shrader. Um, she's in the CUNY system and she's just, so her posts are just so alive. Those last two are also on Peloton.

So those, um, I think that's just for me and another community that I have. um, there's also lots of provost and vice presidents out there. My original research started in student affairs. That's kind of where I was baked and born and bred. So Melissa, Shrivers from the Ohio. Regina Hyatt from Mississippi state to Miller from James Madison.

[00:33:00] Um, I mean, and the biggest thing you're gonna see is they are out and about whether, if that is capturing moments that happen online or like literally out and. And this is another lesson is don't diminish. Even the simple moments that you have. Like mm-hmm okay. Someone brought in cookies, like, okay, maybe then you explain like why chocolate chip is just like the bomb or why oatmeal raisin is the worst thing ever, because, so I know again, I'm explaining these things and you're like that isn't the work we do.

We don't do cookie work. Yes. But I go, okay. But you should, maybe cookies are great. Um, When you post stuff like that, you build communities. So then when you do post the campus announcement, that is going to be heartbreaking or a change or information or something, you need someone to actually do something with you've hooked them, you've hooked them with cookies, and now you're gonna get them to do the call for action.[00:34:00] 

Um, and then the last ones, uh, some of my favorite vice presidents right now are in marketing because not only. People like you and Jenny petty and Ken, you get the platforms, you get the tactics and by role modeling your own learning and connection and community, I feel like you're elevating the whole industry.

Um, and so those, you know, so I just have a few, but I, I wouldn't be surprised if there's more out there and I'm always finding more. So folks can always send them to me and. I'm I'm an easy follow . 

Jaime Hunt: One of my, my favorite, um, presidents on Twitter is Tom Chesney at Clark university. Oh yes. Yep. I love how he also, he doesn't just post, he also interacts on other people's posts.

Like he, you, you can see that it's not just a, like a checkbox, like post this picture of whatever. Engaging with the community [00:35:00] beyond the initial post. Um, and I just love that about him and he's doing like those, you know, his most recent or his pin tweet right now is, you know, a cup of coffee on his deck being excited about students moving back.

And it's, it feels more authentic than some other more stilted, I guess, posts. Um, what, what thoughts do you have about like engaging in that community versus just kind of having a sharing tactic? 

Josie Ahlquist: I'm so glad you brought up, Tom, I've done a couple like panels with him and he's in the book too. And I think another ingredient, if you were to look at metrics, it's not just, what are they tweeting, but look in their replies to see, okay, what are they actually interacting back and not just in their own posts.

Riley is another great one. She's at, um, Arkansas Fort Smith. And in doing it in a way. You were really speaking like in your language, not again like this kind of robotic message. [00:36:00] Um, so I think it honestly should be equal parts posting to equal parts, you know, like interacting and listening even, um, a lot of leaders that I've interviewed.

Talk about first thing in the morning. Well, hopefully not the very first thing, but they will just social listen and they will scroll and they'll. Search a hashtag or a tag location on Instagram to see what their community is up to. Like it's not getting information just by what people are sending you in.

Your email is not a representation of what's really been happening and to not be scared of it. I think a lot of leaders are worried. Well, I don't wanna see what. Have posted, um, on ONAC or Instagram last night. Um, and, and I can get that. And obviously if you see something, some things you might need to say something, but also the growth of further understanding.

And that's where, again, some interaction, cuz I guarantee like if you were [00:37:00] to reply to a student. You're gonna make their day . Oh yeah. Um, and, or just even to like a post that your main institutional accounts put out can really fill the cup of a social media manager to be like, oh wow. My president or my provost saw this.

Um, and so again, it doesn't have to be these grand gestures. It can be really simple, um, ways to acknowledge people in the digital. 

Jaime Hunt: It's so funny you say that about the excitement of being liked by the president. I , our president at Miami had, um, a, I don't know, imposter account set up that was liking and following and engaging with a lot of people.

And my husband and I both had multiple of the people that we are friends with on Twitter. Say like your president just followed me on Twitter. Like all excited. But it, it was, it was like kind of this like, oh my gosh, the president is following me or the president liked something. I said, [00:38:00] and then that person was the, the imposter was messaging about, um, purchasing cryptocurrency.

So that was, oh dear, probably a tip that it wasn't the real president, but yeah, that can really make student's day. . 

Josie Ahlquist: Yeah, well, what a case study to actually see it work, even though it wasn't real and right. That's the other element within the marketing office, make sure you're grabbing up usernames and protecting that brand.

Um, and keeping an eye out, you know, I've I find some and I let the president know. Hey, just so you know, there's another Instagram account out there for you. And they're able to, you know, put in a. 

Jaime Hunt: and a lot of leaders I think, would be eligible for, um, the verified account status if they're posting regularly and they're at like a certain level, I would imagine.

And I think that could help. That's something we've talked about trying to get, um, the president's account to be a verified account. Um, so that it's less likely that an imposter would be mistaken is the real thing. Right. 

Josie Ahlquist: Yeah. I mean, and also to know that it it's [00:39:00] happening in lots of different industries like this last summer, um, astrologers in that area, like went under attack, like I guess, um, all these.

Yeah. It's just so strange where people, and again, it's, they're always trying to sell something crypto or like, you know, I'll do a reading and anyway, I'm, I'm letting you in on a little bit of woo woo in my life. 

Jaime Hunt: that? That is very interesting. Um, it's. Like when you think about the spaces, you're not in what is going on in those spaces.

Right. It's also interesting. Yeah. If somebody wants to dip their toe into this, what recommendations do you have? And I will make my first recommendation is that is Josie's book. But beyond that, what recommendations would you have Josie? 

Josie Ahlquist: I think like I was sharing a number of leaders earlier is just start to follow and pay attention to on just one platform.

Don't feel like, okay, I gotta get on all the things. And I wanna, you know, like do a competitor [00:40:00] analysis of all those elements and then just start to try on and situate yourself, like how you might see yourself doing something like that. Um, and then seeing. It, what's just the one platform that you feel like maybe you've got already some skills you would be interested, interested into creating just a sliver of a strategy and then set a goal.

I'm gonna post once a week on LinkedIn, all you know, all semester. And hopefully it'll be like, you know, Just like the starter set that then you end up posting more, uh, and then not just posting, but maybe the second post is going to be the interaction. And so hopefully we're gonna build from there. Cause what some leaders will do, they'll go all in.

They'll be all active and then they get burned out or they get tired. So we wanna, my goal is always to find strategy that's sustainable and scalable. So that means we need to build up to it. and then as we, as we [00:41:00] go, we're gonna gonna get your own rhythm and pace and, and hopefully get some wins too. So you start to see like, oh, I did not think this post would be so well received or students would be this excited to take a selfie with me getting those wins as we go, um, is just really, really a fun thing for me too.

Jaime Hunt: it's fun to watch, like goals be met and, um, to see like, okay, yeah, this is moving forward and it can be, it can take a while to build a following, but I I've found that it's sort of, there's like a tipping point where you hit a point and then it just snowballs. Um, and you, you know, more and more people have.

Access to a retweet. You like you, that puts you in front of more people and gives you a broader reach and opportunity to have influence and something you said earlier really jumped out at me the idea of sort of having a goal for what you're trying to do. Big picture, um, you know, like for me, it's, I want to elevate this profession that I work in and to.

[00:42:00] you know, do whatever I can do to, um, encourage empathetic, compassionate leadership. So that's like for me, oh, I love that. That touchpoint has to keep going back to that. So I think is that something, somebody should kind of set up right away? Like this is my ultimate big picture goal of why I'm doing this.

Oh my 

Josie Ahlquist: gosh. Yeah. Just you saying it is like, it gets you in the fields, right? Like it's, what's gonna call you back onto Twitter. Not. Okay. I set a goal that I was gonna post every day on Twitter. Um, is why is it gonna matter that you were even on Twitter, will it matter? And that's not to diminish you as a person or Twitter, but like, Whenever Twitter goes away or like, whatever it continues on to be, what is it?

You wanna know that you made an impact cuz you chose to be on that platform and that's within strategy can start to look differently at, at each like the way you show up on Facebook or Instagram, knowing people are in different places. And maybe the impact that you [00:43:00] wanna make is gonna look a little bit different on those tools too.

Jaime Hunt: Yeah, absolutely. I think for me personally, Facebook is I try to have under 300. People on it, it's people I actually know. And it's my diary for all practical purposes. It's I love hitting the, like, look at your memories and, and remembering stuff that happened a year ago. Um, but Twitter is entirely different thing for me and I'm gonna be dipping into, into TikTok and, um, there's, it's always like two.

How do you decide, when does that platform hit critical mass that you need to kind of be. Thinking about having a presence there. Do you talk about that at all with the folks that you coach and consult with? 

Josie Ahlquist: I mean, I think it's the same thing with, um, protecting an overall brand is grab up a username if you have, like, I'm always Josie Quis everywhere.

Um, not everywhere, just Josie Quis um, and so, yeah, I've like on be real. I I've, I have my handle there just cuz like. [00:44:00] Ideally, if I go on a new tool, I would hope that's what it would be. The other element to get on a tool early, um, is for social listening. And that's how we learn is just observing for example, TikTok or be real, be real notifications are driving me crazy though.

And so I had to delete that app , but, um, because those that we serve, not all of them, but do tend to. Pre-teens teens and young adults who are statistically more likely to be early adopters on platforms that we are not mm-hmm . And so whether you're on them or you have other informants just giving you a heads up about what's coming, I do think is part of being a leader in higher ed, just like any other trend, um, within our, within our field.

Jaime Hunt: Yeah, absolutely. So one of the things that, that you. Talk about a lot is empathy. And how does that play a role in being a digital [00:45:00] leader? 

Josie Ahlquist: So the way I situate a lot of my keynotes is we do a walk through time. I was born in the eighties. Jamie, I don't know if when you were born, but I think about my early memories of tech and my first experiences with.

Social media that would've been on desktop. Right. And then I situate that with how old I was, or was I in high school, college and the choices I did or didn't have to make. Because those technologies were or were not available like Josie on spring break. My freshman year, didn't have to worry about, you know, a lot of technology pretty much today.

Um, young adults are, have to be hyper aware and are making, having to make choices. And sometimes those choices are made for them cuz they didn't even know a video was going on in the background. Because I get a lot of fear from adults and leaders [00:46:00] about how youth use technology and, and how they're turning out, or, or maybe it's even, um, newer professionals or younger professionals and how they're always on their phones.

And so I always try to start with. Like, would you be a college president if you had Twitter in college? I, I don't know. Or I don't know if I'd be doing what I'm doing. , you know, I miss my space by a month. Um, and so that's one level of empathy. Right. And, and also why I wanted to study students is we don't ask them directly a lot.

Like, do you actually love social? Like or how do you feel when you go on these tools? And there is as. Concern and resistance that we have, they experience it yet. There's a bit more peer pressure and performance elements. And that really is where they find community yet. We don't provide [00:47:00] them a lot of.

Positive coaching and empowerment around it. Um, and so many times I'm getting in front of students with that empathetic lens to not just shame them. Um, but to give 'em like, no, just tell me how I can fall asleep at night. Stop looking at TikTok before you go to bed. That is like a guarantee like, and that's like a lesson of mine, right?

Like I need to move my phone physically away from my. Um, and so empathy though doesn't mean, okay. We just kind of give over our souls to these tools as leaders. We want to see which ones or any of them that are problematic. And then either for our own sake or for the people around us, set boundaries, push for policies like no, what these tools are and are not possible for.

Um, and yeah, again, at the end of the day, like we just. More, we need good humans, more good [00:48:00] humans on these tools, whether what, no matter what position that you're in, um, I think will be we better for it. No matter, um, what industry you're talking about. 

Jaime Hunt: that's so true. I think cuz some people say things like, oh, Twitter's so toxic.

And it's like, well, but not if you situate yourself in a circle of people that aren't that way. Um, certainly still bad things can, can happen, but I, I find it to be more life affirming than. Um, draining, um, to be present on present on Twitter. So is there any reading out there beyond your book that you would recommend?

I know you have a lot of blogs, blog posts around this topic. Anything else you can recommend for folks? 

Josie Ahlquist: Oh gosh. Well, it kind of goes back to. Another comment you shared earlier about the choice to be outspoken or speaking out about specific issues. There was an article that came out in the Chronicle about how less presidents are even wanting [00:49:00] to talk to, for example, the Chronicle or journalists.

And we also see this in social media that is it worth to put myself out there or make this statement. And I mean, I feel like in when you work in an industry like our. Based upon values based decisions. There are things that are worth the pushback. Um, we, we've also seen though, like leaders having a statement about everything, right?

It's almost like crying Wolf. Like if you make a statement on everything, does anything really start to matter? What I hope again is like what the values based strategy is. It can become more clear when you need to. Clearly make a stand. Um, and again, I think that's where working, working with a marketing department will significantly help you there.

Um, as far as though other readings, again, I'm just gonna push people to social media, like follow, what are they, what are, what articles are they sharing? What are they posting? That's where you're gonna [00:50:00] learn the most because, um, yeah, just learn by watching and then get out there and get. 

Jaime Hunt: That that is great advice.

Get out there and get doing. I love that. So Josie, where can people find you? I know you said you're Josie. Elquis on all platforms. And then what is your web website 

Josie Ahlquist: address? So it's just my name, Josie alquist.com. Um, and you can email me at Josie, Josie alquist.com. Um, I do live in LA if you're ever in town please, please let me know.

I'm not always here. Um, but yeah, please find me on all the, on the, all the interweb. 

Jaime Hunt: The series of tubes or whatever it was that that Senator many years ago said. And before we wrap. I, I just wanna say I'm looking at Josie's office and I can see in the background, um, her book's organized by rainbow color and I just have to like do a fist bump because like everything in my life is organized by [00:51:00] rainbow as well.

Shirts, pants, dresses, everything like I you're you're um, a kindred spirit Josie. 

Josie Ahlquist: Well, I am tickled that you noticed that I actually just reorganized. Yesterday. And maybe it was cuz I knew that we were talking but I, cuz I kept looking at it. I was like, you know what? That would just be. So that'd be like the next level right of just, but I have done it to my clothes too.

I just Marie condo my life. Um, so I appreciate it. I'll take a photo that you can, you can share 

Jaime Hunt: yeah. You might have to tweet about your rainbow bookshelf. There you go. Well, thank you, Josie. And for the listeners, please, you can always find me on Twitter at Jamie hunt. IMC, J a I M E H U N T IMC. I'm also on LinkedIn.

Um, my website is the higher ed cmo.com. If you wanna have a conversation about this episode, use the hashtag higher ed. CMO during the conversation. I'd love to hear your [00:52:00] thoughts on this topic and, um, until then have a great rest of your day. Let's go bust some silos and never forget you are worthy. Have a great day.

Josie Ahlquist: Hey, all Zack here from Enrollify. I hope you enjoyed this episode of confessions of a higher ed CMO with Jaime Hunt. If you like this episode, do us a huge favor and hit that follow and subscribe button below. Furthermore, if you've got just two minutes to spare, we would greatly appreciate you leaving a rating and a review of this show on apple podcasts.

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